Sununu knows better than to think that Trump will get 51% of the vote, or a plurality at all. (Trump hasn't gotten more votes than his opponent in either of his general election match-ups.)
He needs to find a better excuse if he's going to insist on contradicting everything he stood for before this match up, in exchange for future electoral viability.
Sununu does know better concerning Trump’s electability. His better excuse is supporting down ticket Republican elections in NH. And I do not expect him to give up his political viability. Supporting Trump is not the logical conclusion to his earlier Trump statements. He has not given up his policy beliefs. Personally I have no problem being outside the Trump GOP. I have voted for Sununu 4 election cycles and would consider him for future office.
He also wouldn't be blazing any trails if he said that he is leaving the top of the ticket blank, but will be supporting every Republican beneath that line.
Sununu was never a Trumpist….but that doesn’t mean he’s for Biden either. Voting for what one would consider the lesser evil (based on your POV) rather than someone you actually support, is hardly a new problem or new reality.
Thanks for this post. In a two party system, there are only two choices. Sununu is a Republican. He has made it clear he doesn't like Trump, but like Brian Kemp he is also not going to support Biden. Is this what I want? No. Could he have not supported Trump? Maybe. I'm glad when pols say they won't vote for Trump, but I am also understanding in cases like this one and Kemp.
In a tip of the hat to good old Paul Harvey; here's the "rest of the story" from JVL (who is far from a pearl clutch-er):
"It is not true that 51 percent of America supports Donald Trump. He’s currently polling at 45.6 percent."
"Trump has never polled higher that 48 percent in the RealClear average1 and even in individual polls, he has only been at 51 percent a handful of times (nearly all of which came from the same pollster)."
Oddly i read JVL's piece from yesterday minutes before reading Steve's. Curious takes from two guys i respect. Supporting the down ballot was obviously apparent in AZ in 2020, and in many of the other battle ground states.
I guess Chris should be thankful that George didn't call him on the polling data. He already told us too many times about how it was all just a reality TV show (or however he whisked away trump's sins).
There-in is the problem with trump, everything is just a reality TV show and there are only two things that matter: 1). What are my ratings? 2). How much money will the rubes send me based off of those ratings.
What's the difference? Had Sinunu been saying that trump was out polling Biden, neither JVL or me would have had an argument about his comments. We've simply become accustomed to "alternative facts" dominating how and what people say.
I know the argument, "every politician does it." No one, NO ONE, ever in our history has taken it to the preposterous levels trump has. Kudos to George Santos for trying, but he was minor league compared to the reality TV star turned "potential" criminal. See how easy this is to at least try and be truthful.
Then you’re hair splitting. It’s politics. You and JVL didn’t complain when Sununu was saying there is no way Trump will be the nominee despite the polling showing that was not really the case. Sununu was just doing politics you happened to agree with. The fact is Trump will probably lose which Sununu in the past has said. But he wants other races to have Republican winners, so is he supposed to tell voters to stay home or vote for Biden on the top line and other R on down ticket? Is he really supposed to tell voters to leave the presidential ticket blank but show up to vote for down ticket races? That makes no political sense and Sununu is doing politics.
"You and JVL didn’t complain when Sununu was saying there is no way Trump will be the nominee despite the polling showing that was not really the case."
It may be behind a paywall, but JVL has been complaining about Sununu pretty consistently since last year for comments like the ones he made recently. His latest piece (that you quoted) is only the latest in a LONG line of anti-Sununu JVL posts.
I normally avoid back and forth exchanges, but in this case i am making an exception. Because for me, this discussion has little to do with what anyone feels about Chris Sununu. He might be the greatest guy in the world. That simply is immaterial to the discussion.
Sununu's point is obvious; winning is everything as long as they are part and parcel of the "new republican party." That would be defined as donald trump's version of it. If he believes (and if you believe) that's the right thing for this country, then both of you will vote for him. Up ballot, down ballot, doesn't matter in the slightest because if the end game is trump is president, the game known as democracy as we know it is done. Sorry, not hyperbole, he has told us point blank his agenda.
The argument Joe is too liberal is laughable. The argument he's part of a "crime family" is laughable." The fact the house is wasting time on impeachment hearings for Mayorkas when the world's problems are front and center is sinful in the least and dare i say criminal? The right's priorities have been reduced to a single outcome; "what does trump want/need?"
That's it Steve. End of story. When has one man ever become more important than the needs of the country? The world? Now, if you buy the donald is the only one who can save us, then you'll vote for him. Hell, you'll be out there endorsing him and encouraging others to do so (like Sununu).
That's why he came under fire. You know that as well as i do. It may all just be "politics", but the question for every voter come this November is simple: What should our politics, our country look like in 2025?
Sununu is looking to be part of a post Trump GOP. Republicans get to decide this. Personally I would rather be without party if Trump is the standard. But I understand why he decided to support the party nominee to have a seat at future change. He is certainly not a Trump guy.
He's not, but. Thanks for your response Jay and it is really the nexus of the discussion. Curtis is right, the vote will come down to who believes what? Oh yeah, and how pissed off the women are in the country.
The question i have for every republican always goes back to the basics: What is the price of winning? At all costs? For the sake of the party? For the sake of the country? Those can easily be answered if all that matters is party affiliation.
One of the reasons i read The Bulwark and The Racket every day is because it is a fascinating study in human nature. I don't need/don't want the left wing song and dance; i lived it. I know the mantra, i sang it. I want to see what the fall-away republicans are saying, thinking and why?
Here's my take; those of you who bled red and fled to be "independents" (a very large number by the way) are the most honorable and most honest amongst you. And here's why; trump is no republican; trump is no democrat (although he claimed he was at one time). He's simply a man devoid of principles, values or morals.
Those of you struggling to pull the lever for him have morals, values and principles. In fact, when you are intellectually honest with yourselves, there isn't much about trump to like. Whatever his redeeming qualities are seen by the maga-mob, they aren't qualities you are attracted to.
In my opinion, JVL's article is part of him "thinking out loud" as he tries to understand the oddity that perplexes many of us; why if a person hates trump, both what he stands for and what he does, how they can publicly support and endorse him? The broken, dismembered and destroyed list of solid-to-the-core republicans who have had kiss his ass and be repentant screams volumes to all of us who have watched their debasement. It's truly pitiful (and trump lusts for it)
Is Sununu just another in a long line? Or, is he, as you suggested, sticking around to pick up the pieces come 2025? If so, at what price?
Depends on whether one believes that Joe Biden will do more permanent damage to the USA or vice versa. I think that's what your argument boils down to. If so, I agree.
Sununu knows better than to think that Trump will get 51% of the vote, or a plurality at all. (Trump hasn't gotten more votes than his opponent in either of his general election match-ups.)
He needs to find a better excuse if he's going to insist on contradicting everything he stood for before this match up, in exchange for future electoral viability.
Sununu does know better concerning Trump’s electability. His better excuse is supporting down ticket Republican elections in NH. And I do not expect him to give up his political viability. Supporting Trump is not the logical conclusion to his earlier Trump statements. He has not given up his policy beliefs. Personally I have no problem being outside the Trump GOP. I have voted for Sununu 4 election cycles and would consider him for future office.
He also wouldn't be blazing any trails if he said that he is leaving the top of the ticket blank, but will be supporting every Republican beneath that line.
Ah but does he care?
Not too much
It’s a 2 party system….so what is one to do?
Sununu was never a Trumpist….but that doesn’t mean he’s for Biden either. Voting for what one would consider the lesser evil (based on your POV) rather than someone you actually support, is hardly a new problem or new reality.
Thanks for this post. In a two party system, there are only two choices. Sununu is a Republican. He has made it clear he doesn't like Trump, but like Brian Kemp he is also not going to support Biden. Is this what I want? No. Could he have not supported Trump? Maybe. I'm glad when pols say they won't vote for Trump, but I am also understanding in cases like this one and Kemp.
In a tip of the hat to good old Paul Harvey; here's the "rest of the story" from JVL (who is far from a pearl clutch-er):
"It is not true that 51 percent of America supports Donald Trump. He’s currently polling at 45.6 percent."
"Trump has never polled higher that 48 percent in the RealClear average1 and even in individual polls, he has only been at 51 percent a handful of times (nearly all of which came from the same pollster)."
Oddly i read JVL's piece from yesterday minutes before reading Steve's. Curious takes from two guys i respect. Supporting the down ballot was obviously apparent in AZ in 2020, and in many of the other battle ground states.
I guess Chris should be thankful that George didn't call him on the polling data. He already told us too many times about how it was all just a reality TV show (or however he whisked away trump's sins).
There-in is the problem with trump, everything is just a reality TV show and there are only two things that matter: 1). What are my ratings? 2). How much money will the rubes send me based off of those ratings.
Quibbles. What’s Biden polling at?
What's the difference? Had Sinunu been saying that trump was out polling Biden, neither JVL or me would have had an argument about his comments. We've simply become accustomed to "alternative facts" dominating how and what people say.
I know the argument, "every politician does it." No one, NO ONE, ever in our history has taken it to the preposterous levels trump has. Kudos to George Santos for trying, but he was minor league compared to the reality TV star turned "potential" criminal. See how easy this is to at least try and be truthful.
Then you’re hair splitting. It’s politics. You and JVL didn’t complain when Sununu was saying there is no way Trump will be the nominee despite the polling showing that was not really the case. Sununu was just doing politics you happened to agree with. The fact is Trump will probably lose which Sununu in the past has said. But he wants other races to have Republican winners, so is he supposed to tell voters to stay home or vote for Biden on the top line and other R on down ticket? Is he really supposed to tell voters to leave the presidential ticket blank but show up to vote for down ticket races? That makes no political sense and Sununu is doing politics.
"You and JVL didn’t complain when Sununu was saying there is no way Trump will be the nominee despite the polling showing that was not really the case."
It may be behind a paywall, but JVL has been complaining about Sununu pretty consistently since last year for comments like the ones he made recently. His latest piece (that you quoted) is only the latest in a LONG line of anti-Sununu JVL posts.
From 9/11/2023: https://www.thebulwark.com/p/how-to-disfigure-your-soul
I normally avoid back and forth exchanges, but in this case i am making an exception. Because for me, this discussion has little to do with what anyone feels about Chris Sununu. He might be the greatest guy in the world. That simply is immaterial to the discussion.
Sununu's point is obvious; winning is everything as long as they are part and parcel of the "new republican party." That would be defined as donald trump's version of it. If he believes (and if you believe) that's the right thing for this country, then both of you will vote for him. Up ballot, down ballot, doesn't matter in the slightest because if the end game is trump is president, the game known as democracy as we know it is done. Sorry, not hyperbole, he has told us point blank his agenda.
The argument Joe is too liberal is laughable. The argument he's part of a "crime family" is laughable." The fact the house is wasting time on impeachment hearings for Mayorkas when the world's problems are front and center is sinful in the least and dare i say criminal? The right's priorities have been reduced to a single outcome; "what does trump want/need?"
That's it Steve. End of story. When has one man ever become more important than the needs of the country? The world? Now, if you buy the donald is the only one who can save us, then you'll vote for him. Hell, you'll be out there endorsing him and encouraging others to do so (like Sununu).
That's why he came under fire. You know that as well as i do. It may all just be "politics", but the question for every voter come this November is simple: What should our politics, our country look like in 2025?
Sununu is looking to be part of a post Trump GOP. Republicans get to decide this. Personally I would rather be without party if Trump is the standard. But I understand why he decided to support the party nominee to have a seat at future change. He is certainly not a Trump guy.
He's not, but. Thanks for your response Jay and it is really the nexus of the discussion. Curtis is right, the vote will come down to who believes what? Oh yeah, and how pissed off the women are in the country.
The question i have for every republican always goes back to the basics: What is the price of winning? At all costs? For the sake of the party? For the sake of the country? Those can easily be answered if all that matters is party affiliation.
One of the reasons i read The Bulwark and The Racket every day is because it is a fascinating study in human nature. I don't need/don't want the left wing song and dance; i lived it. I know the mantra, i sang it. I want to see what the fall-away republicans are saying, thinking and why?
Here's my take; those of you who bled red and fled to be "independents" (a very large number by the way) are the most honorable and most honest amongst you. And here's why; trump is no republican; trump is no democrat (although he claimed he was at one time). He's simply a man devoid of principles, values or morals.
Those of you struggling to pull the lever for him have morals, values and principles. In fact, when you are intellectually honest with yourselves, there isn't much about trump to like. Whatever his redeeming qualities are seen by the maga-mob, they aren't qualities you are attracted to.
In my opinion, JVL's article is part of him "thinking out loud" as he tries to understand the oddity that perplexes many of us; why if a person hates trump, both what he stands for and what he does, how they can publicly support and endorse him? The broken, dismembered and destroyed list of solid-to-the-core republicans who have had kiss his ass and be repentant screams volumes to all of us who have watched their debasement. It's truly pitiful (and trump lusts for it)
Is Sununu just another in a long line? Or, is he, as you suggested, sticking around to pick up the pieces come 2025? If so, at what price?
Depends on whether one believes that Joe Biden will do more permanent damage to the USA or vice versa. I think that's what your argument boils down to. If so, I agree.