Do you have any idea if there exists a precedent for releasing a search warrant prior to any charges being filed?
I'm on-board with seeing that as soon as possible and learning more, but not at the expense of breaching a potential defendant's privacy in cases where the State declines to pursue a trial. That's just repeating the same basic error that James Comey committed when speaking about Clinton, despite not pursuing criminal charges in 2016.
According to USA Today, a warrant can be released any time after it is executed. The affidavit behind the warrant typically remains sealed until charges or indictments are forthcoming. And subpoenas can remain under seal also.
Just to be clear on French's take. From his piece[1]:
"I raise this because already a number of people have asked me about Andy’s piece and because Andy is super-smart. He could be right, but I’m skeptical. He’s describing an extraordinarily high-stakes gamble, executing a warrant on a former president (and current GOP front-runner) for a relatively minor offense in the hopes of incidentally obtaining evidence of much more serious crimes."
"That’s a serious roll of the dice. I’m not saying Andy’s theory is wrong. If he’s correct, then it should shake our confidence in the process."
Just wanted to be clear that French has not signed onto McCarthy's theory yet, but is instead waiting for more information before speculating further.
Agreed. Perhaps I should have put David French in better context. I also do not think Merrick Garland was acting in a pretext or ruse. I think the perception that he or the FBI might have been is potentially very damaging. More information is needed to assure the public. I’m frankly a bit shocked that the government wasn’t better prepared from a message standpoint. Trump’s side was well prepared.
I have an extremely hard time believing that nobody would tell the POTUS that the FBI is about to execute a search warrant with scores of agents on the former POTUS’ personal residence. It’s unthinkable that Biden wouldn’t be told. In fact if he really wasn’t told, that makes me question what ELSE they are not telling him, and that leads to the “who the hell is running the country” line of thought. And don’t argue that this doesn’t rise to the level of the Commander-in-Chief. It absolutely does.
On the contrary: the POTUS should not have any knowledge of DOJ warrants being served and the like, so as to avoid perception of politicization of the DOJ. We don't want POTUS telling the DOJ who to target or investigate: they should be solely following the processes and laws that would lead them to serving a warrant/performing raids/etc....
Thanks for bringing a smile to my face this morning Steve. Actually, i'm being kind, it was more raucous laughter after reading this piece. The demands for Garland to release the search warrants are ludicrous. To do what? Help convince trump supporters they were justified? It won't make two-shits of a difference to him or the sordid bunch of gop'ers who have rallied around him.
The only outcome would be his attorney's to be able to argue the DOJ tainted the waters by releasing said documents. You know that and i know that and neither of us are attorneys. It's the trump game, always has been, always will be.
Think not? Answer me this in one word; yes or no; was the 2020 election stolen? Did trump win? Simple brother; yes or no? Here, let me make the argument for you: "what's that got to do with releasing the search warrant? Everything!
The past 3 years, this entire house of cards about the election being stolen has been repeated so many times it's become an urban legend. One that's not true and there has never been a scintilla of proof, not a fiber, a shred, a shard or a drip. It's been fabricated to the point of absurdity and now lives on as a truth in the minds of way too many.
Everything that has run aground stems from "the big lie." Nearly every feeble minded republican who told us Biden won and the election was clean as a whistle has sold their soul to the devil and is now promoting the election was stolen. Did they see the light? Did they find God? Did the donald speak to them in tongues?
I'm sure you get the point; January 6 happened because of the big lie. The actions to try and install fake electors was all due the big lie. Those being thrown in jail, those testifying before the committee are all a result of his lies. My best guess is, had trump simply walked away after the election, shaking Biden's hand and retiring to Mar A Logo, there never would have been a raid the other day.
The reality is, trump's ego wouldn't allow it; his narcissistic, pathetic and shallow personality was such, he couldn't admit a tired old man beat him. Biden wasn't that popular, trump was that hated. He reaped what he sowed, and he still is.
If trump wants to find someone to blame, he simply need look in the mirror. It's on him. It's on each and every republican who propped him up and let him whine and cry about a stolen election. Those who refused to stop him from spreading the manure; over and over again.
So no, don't harangue about Garland helping destroy his case as this unfolds. Trump's lawyers would love to have the DOJ release the warrant. If the orange guy wants the world to know, let him publish it. Oh, wait, your argument is they won't because he needs to keep it under wraps for his defense.
I don't care if he ever does jail time. What i would love is if the grand old party would grow some balls and tell him to stfu. That will never happen because they are scared stiff of his zealots who could care less about what the warrants says. Who wouldn't know the truth if it hit them in the face. Facts have never mattered to trump, they never will.
I don't even care if he keeps bilking the rubes and the marks for the next twenty years. What i do care about is what he is doing to this country to satisfy his ego. That's freaking shameful.
"My best guess is, had trump simply walked away after the election, shaking Biden's hand and retiring to Mar A Logo, there never would have been a raid the other day."
I'll go a step further and wager that Trump could keep being the Trump we know, and if he left the papers he took with him where they should have been (with the National Archivist), there wouldn't have been a search warrant either. I'm pretty sure that the FBI and DoJ decision makers weren't thrilled to be the first to decide to get a warrant to search the home of a former president.
(Also, let's stop calling it "a raid" - I'm pretty sure that all the doors at Mar-a-Lago are still on their hinges and none of the FBI agents unholstered their weapons. Comment above edited to replace "raid" with "search warrant".)
I'm pretty sure I saw semi-automatic rifles at the ready position. But I agree the weapons and the number of agents involved were for PR purposes - not a raid. Probably produced by the same show biz persons who are scripting the January 6 hearings.
Yep. Just Steve once again making the country bend over backwards to satisfy his friends who have throw reality to the curb in the name of Donald Trump. The FBI doesn't owe Trump or any republican talking head anything.
Updated to change "2020" to "2016" election regarding James Comey. My poisoned pen has been melted into slag.
Do you have any idea if there exists a precedent for releasing a search warrant prior to any charges being filed?
I'm on-board with seeing that as soon as possible and learning more, but not at the expense of breaching a potential defendant's privacy in cases where the State declines to pursue a trial. That's just repeating the same basic error that James Comey committed when speaking about Clinton, despite not pursuing criminal charges in 2016.
According to USA Today, a warrant can be released any time after it is executed. The affidavit behind the warrant typically remains sealed until charges or indictments are forthcoming. And subpoenas can remain under seal also.
Just to be clear on French's take. From his piece[1]:
"I raise this because already a number of people have asked me about Andy’s piece and because Andy is super-smart. He could be right, but I’m skeptical. He’s describing an extraordinarily high-stakes gamble, executing a warrant on a former president (and current GOP front-runner) for a relatively minor offense in the hopes of incidentally obtaining evidence of much more serious crimes."
"That’s a serious roll of the dice. I’m not saying Andy’s theory is wrong. If he’s correct, then it should shake our confidence in the process."
Just wanted to be clear that French has not signed onto McCarthy's theory yet, but is instead waiting for more information before speculating further.
[1] https://frenchpress.thedispatch.com/p/thinking-through-the-trump-search
Agreed. Perhaps I should have put David French in better context. I also do not think Merrick Garland was acting in a pretext or ruse. I think the perception that he or the FBI might have been is potentially very damaging. More information is needed to assure the public. I’m frankly a bit shocked that the government wasn’t better prepared from a message standpoint. Trump’s side was well prepared.
I imagine it's due to the DOJ acting without informing POTUS: my understanding is that POTUS was not informed prior.
There is no duty to inform the subject of a search warrant of the existence of the warrant. In fact, doing so generally spoils the whole intent.
I was referring to the current POTUS, not the former. My understanding is that Biden was not informed prior to the warrant being served and executed.
https://www.reuters.com/world/us/biden-not-briefed-raid-trumps-florida-home-white-house-says-2022-08-09/
I have an extremely hard time believing that nobody would tell the POTUS that the FBI is about to execute a search warrant with scores of agents on the former POTUS’ personal residence. It’s unthinkable that Biden wouldn’t be told. In fact if he really wasn’t told, that makes me question what ELSE they are not telling him, and that leads to the “who the hell is running the country” line of thought. And don’t argue that this doesn’t rise to the level of the Commander-in-Chief. It absolutely does.
On the contrary: the POTUS should not have any knowledge of DOJ warrants being served and the like, so as to avoid perception of politicization of the DOJ. We don't want POTUS telling the DOJ who to target or investigate: they should be solely following the processes and laws that would lead them to serving a warrant/performing raids/etc....
Thanks for bringing a smile to my face this morning Steve. Actually, i'm being kind, it was more raucous laughter after reading this piece. The demands for Garland to release the search warrants are ludicrous. To do what? Help convince trump supporters they were justified? It won't make two-shits of a difference to him or the sordid bunch of gop'ers who have rallied around him.
The only outcome would be his attorney's to be able to argue the DOJ tainted the waters by releasing said documents. You know that and i know that and neither of us are attorneys. It's the trump game, always has been, always will be.
Think not? Answer me this in one word; yes or no; was the 2020 election stolen? Did trump win? Simple brother; yes or no? Here, let me make the argument for you: "what's that got to do with releasing the search warrant? Everything!
The past 3 years, this entire house of cards about the election being stolen has been repeated so many times it's become an urban legend. One that's not true and there has never been a scintilla of proof, not a fiber, a shred, a shard or a drip. It's been fabricated to the point of absurdity and now lives on as a truth in the minds of way too many.
Everything that has run aground stems from "the big lie." Nearly every feeble minded republican who told us Biden won and the election was clean as a whistle has sold their soul to the devil and is now promoting the election was stolen. Did they see the light? Did they find God? Did the donald speak to them in tongues?
I'm sure you get the point; January 6 happened because of the big lie. The actions to try and install fake electors was all due the big lie. Those being thrown in jail, those testifying before the committee are all a result of his lies. My best guess is, had trump simply walked away after the election, shaking Biden's hand and retiring to Mar A Logo, there never would have been a raid the other day.
The reality is, trump's ego wouldn't allow it; his narcissistic, pathetic and shallow personality was such, he couldn't admit a tired old man beat him. Biden wasn't that popular, trump was that hated. He reaped what he sowed, and he still is.
If trump wants to find someone to blame, he simply need look in the mirror. It's on him. It's on each and every republican who propped him up and let him whine and cry about a stolen election. Those who refused to stop him from spreading the manure; over and over again.
So no, don't harangue about Garland helping destroy his case as this unfolds. Trump's lawyers would love to have the DOJ release the warrant. If the orange guy wants the world to know, let him publish it. Oh, wait, your argument is they won't because he needs to keep it under wraps for his defense.
I don't care if he ever does jail time. What i would love is if the grand old party would grow some balls and tell him to stfu. That will never happen because they are scared stiff of his zealots who could care less about what the warrants says. Who wouldn't know the truth if it hit them in the face. Facts have never mattered to trump, they never will.
I don't even care if he keeps bilking the rubes and the marks for the next twenty years. What i do care about is what he is doing to this country to satisfy his ego. That's freaking shameful.
"My best guess is, had trump simply walked away after the election, shaking Biden's hand and retiring to Mar A Logo, there never would have been a raid the other day."
I'll go a step further and wager that Trump could keep being the Trump we know, and if he left the papers he took with him where they should have been (with the National Archivist), there wouldn't have been a search warrant either. I'm pretty sure that the FBI and DoJ decision makers weren't thrilled to be the first to decide to get a warrant to search the home of a former president.
(Also, let's stop calling it "a raid" - I'm pretty sure that all the doors at Mar-a-Lago are still on their hinges and none of the FBI agents unholstered their weapons. Comment above edited to replace "raid" with "search warrant".)
I'm pretty sure I saw semi-automatic rifles at the ready position. But I agree the weapons and the number of agents involved were for PR purposes - not a raid. Probably produced by the same show biz persons who are scripting the January 6 hearings.
One pic I've seen of personnel holding ARs in front of a SUV at the entrance to Mar-a-lago are Secret Service agents, not FBI.
Let me know if you have a link and I'll take a look. Seems odd that FBI agents would be bearing rifles in this context.
One image I've seen is https://ca-times.brightspotcdn.com/dims4/default/d4d35b1/2147483647/strip/true/crop/2000x1333+0+0/resize/1486x990!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcalifornia-times-brightspot.s3.amazonaws.com%2F0d%2F6f%2F39a4b4854a16ac6a786c0ad4dee1%2Ftrump-fbi-16845.jpg
Note the SECRET SERVICE identification on the vest.
Or this guy: seems like in the same entrance https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/3998377317527dd8dcc16264531281664e313577/0_77_3500_2101/master/3500.jpg?width=620&quality=85&fit=max&s=f51e67eaecb39b9be21ea350f384cb92
No links. Just what I saw on TV. It does appear some had rifles when arresting Roger Stone. So, it probably happens.
https://www.kwbu.org/2019-02-01/fact-check-did-the-fbi-use-unusual-force-when-it-arrested-roger-stone
Agreed: it's not a raid, it was far more genteel.
Yep. Just Steve once again making the country bend over backwards to satisfy his friends who have throw reality to the curb in the name of Donald Trump. The FBI doesn't owe Trump or any republican talking head anything.
FYI: DOJ looking to unseal the warrant per https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2022/08/11/garland-doj-statement/10299617002/
And reportedly there was a subpoena that went ignored? https://twitter.com/maggieNYT/status/1557774627887267843